Ep. 52- Amy Claire's Story

Becky and Autumn sit down with Amy Claire to share her story. Amy Claire is a wife, mom of three kids, dancer, and cancer survivor. She’s currently studying to become a therapist.

Amy Claire shares how she grew up in a religious and structured household, and entered the adult world being very naive. She felt it was hard to learn to navigate life when she’d come from a bubble. 

Amy Claire discusses how she met her husband in college, and he seemed like such a great guy. It wasn’t until about six years into the marriage, after returning from a deployment in Iraq, that things started to feel off with a close male friend of her husband’s. But she was unprepared to see or understand what was actually happening in her marriage.

I had betrayal blindness. My mind was so powerful because it was protecting me. I wasn’t ready to know the truth.

Amy Claire describes how by the thirteenth year of marriage, things had become very rocky between her and her husband. He eventually revealed that he’d been looking at gay porn their entire marriage, and that he’d been unfaithful to her for most of it. She was completely blindsided.

My whole marriage was a lie. My whole life came flooding back like a movie reel.

After discovering her husband had been hiding a dual life for so long, Amy Claire shares that her betrayal was compounded by the revelation that he was gay, as well as by family members withholding information from her and therapists shaming her. She and her husband divorced, and she took a break from both her religion and from God.

She remarried shortly after the divorce. 

I thought, “I’m going to heal my broken heart by finding someone else and he’s going to fix me.”

Amy Claire describes that she did not yet possess the tools to be able to heal from the impact of all she had been through. A short time into the marriage, it became clear that her new husband was also being deceptive and betraying her. They immediately started intensive therapy and twelve step groups. “LifeStar was a game changer. I finally found people who knew my pain,” Amy Claire says. 

Things really began changing for her when her Book of Mormon fell open to Moroni chapter 7. Amy Claire says, “It told me that if you trust in God, He will give you the light and knowledge to know the difference between truth and lies.”  

God was saying, “You can stay [in the marriage], but I will let you know. I decided to let Him lead.”

Amy Claire realized she now had the best teammate, God, and that together, they could do this.

Autumn reminds us that, “true recovery is us giving our addict to God and knowing whatever happens, I’m going to be okay.”

Unfortunately, Amy Claire later discovered her husband was still betraying her, even while engaging in false recovery. She shares how she realized that going to LifeStar was for her, not for her husband because he chose not to use the tools he’d been provided with. After having a dream in which she was being buried alive, she realized she would die if she stayed in the marriage.

Amy Claire describes the feelings she had at this point in her life, when she had tools to recover:

I knew I would still be okay even though I had a second divorce under my belt.

Becky shares that we “often wonder, ‘Why do I have to do this recovery?’ But the healing that takes place is so beautiful.”

Amy Claire explains that this time around, she had a powerhouse of women behind her, and she began using boundaries with both of her ex-husbands. 

Slowly, through the hardships she and her children experienced, Amy Claire describes that she is finding happiness. She is now married to a man who supports her, and she feels peace. 

Becky reminds us that through family challenges, we can remember that we can’t redeem our children or ourselves because we are not a redeemer. 

There is only one Redeemer. He will truly redeem our children.

Becky further shares a fundamental principle: “The most important thing you can do is keep God at your center,” she says. “And you will know. Even if people don’t understand or disagree, you will know [what to do] if you have God at your center.”

When asked how she is finding restoration through Christ, Amy Claire explains that she enjoys self-care, which is, for her, listening to podcasts and going to therapy.

Amy Claire’s Recovery Resources:

Qualified Therapy

Intensive Outpatient Program

12 Step Groups

Podcasts

Self-care

Support system- good women who were there for her

Amy Claire’s Song:

“Need You Now (How Many Times)” by Plumb

Ep. 51- Gaslighting 101 with Sarah Morales, Certified Life and Relationship Coach

Becky and Tiffany sit down with Certified Life and Relationship Coach and podcaster (“Deconstructing Gaslighting”), Sarah Morales, to learn the basics of Gaslighting. Sarah shares that she loves to exercise, hang out on TikTok, and is an unapologetically enthusiastic band mom for her two sons.

Sarah believes that recognizing gaslighting is a tool that betrayed partners can gain over time, and it can make a big difference in our health, safety, and quality of life. 

After years and years of study, Sarah has come to understand that gaslighting is both a behavior that someone does and an experience between two or more people. According to Sarah:

“Gaslighting is when one person or a group of people through covert behaviors convinces the other person that what they think, believe, perceive, or feel is inaccurate or invalid.”

Sarah reminds us that “covert” doesn’t mean evil or premeditated. Sometimes the gaslighter isn’t even aware they’re doing it.

The spouse of an addict has typically experienced various forms of gaslighting, often for many years. When asked what it feels like to be gaslit, Sarah says, 

“Walk around in shoes that are two sizes too small for a day. That’s what it feels like to be gaslit. (We realize) this doesn’t feel right. Those thoughts, perspectives, and values are being imposed on me.”

Through her research, Sarah has created a scale to help determine what types of gaslighting are taking place in our relationships, the perpetrator’s motivations, and the steps we can take to protect ourselves from it. She says: 

“When you recognize it’s happening, what do you do? It depends on who the offender is. If it’s someone who’s trying to work on themselves, you deal with that one way. There are different ways to engage with different gaslighters.”

Sarah shares that, often we are not able to recognize gaslighting in the moment—it’s not until later that it hits you that it was gaslighting. When this is happening, Sarah recommends we start journaling. This helps us sort out patterns and feelings. “Never confront your person until you’re clear on what you know to be true,” Sarah says. “Also, usually don’t say, ‘You’re gaslighting me.’ Unless that person is willing and wanting to work on themselves, you’ll just be poking the bear.” 

Sarah also reminds that:

Even if the person’s intent isn’t to gaslight you, but they’re still gaslighting you, it’s abusive.

The most effective way to work through the gaslighting is, Sarah shares, using a three-pronged approach:

1. Get more educated about gaslighting 

Sarah uses an analogy involving arrows and targets. She shares that gaslighting is like the arrows, the gaslighter is the person who is shooting the arrows, and the person who is on the receiving end is the target. If we can identify the arrows, we can step out of their way more quickly. Sarah discusses how we don’t want to just focus on working on ourselves, because then we’ll still be hit with the arrows, and we don’t want to just focus on the gaslighting arrows because if we don’t understand what sucks us in, we’ll still be hit. 

2. Boundaries work

3. Values work

Sarah describes how boundaries either help us live out our values or protect our values, depending on the situation. She believes the more you know yourself, the better you’re going to be able to stand your ground and know if you need to step away from the person who is gaslighting you.

Sarah encourages approaching your values work and figuring out what your values are as if you’re trying to buy a pair of pants. She recommends trying them all on at least once. 

One good way to respond to gaslighting in the moment, Sarah believes, is saying: “I need to give that some thought.” The more we know we have choice and power, the more we know we don’t have to respond in that exact moment. 

One of the most tragic effects of gaslighting is when, according to Sarah, “their voice becomes our voice and then we’re gaslighting ourselves….most of us are so beaten down that we’ve lost our voice.” 

She shares she has worked with women who could no longer tell her their favorite color because of the complete disconnection from themselves. These women become frozen, unable to make even the smallest decision.

“Think of gaslighting like chipping away an iceberg and YOU’RE the iceberg,” Sarah says. “If you hear it over and over again, you start to doubt yourself.”

As is the case with so many aspects of recovery, the podcast team reminds us of the importance of a trusted network of support people in our lives. We can turn to them for clarity, validation, love, trust, and to help us find and see truth.

Find your people.

Sarah concludes the podcast by providing a list of common red flags to be aware of as we try to understand the ins and outs of gaslighting:

*Feeling confusion

*Feeling self-doubt

*Feeling the need to always be apologizing for things

*Finding yourself explaining yourself all the time…why you want things, why you feel this way, etc…

*All of your conversations feel like you’re in a courtroom

*Feeling like it’s a power play

*The words “should” or “shouldn’t” in the language the gaslighter uses

*Mutuality (shared responsibility) is a thing, look for it. Typically, in gaslighting relationships, mutuality isn’t there

*Finding yourself often in a state of internal conflict

*It’s often more about what isn’t said or what’s inferred (the inference is where the power is)

Sarah’s Resources:

Podcast: Deconstructing Gaslighting

Sarah Morales Coaching, on IG and FB

www.sarahmoralescoaching.com

@sassysarahdeconstructs on TikTok

Sarah’s song: 

“Wide Awake” by Katy Perry